Crane Paths and Kotei Choices

Casual conversations about anything you want!
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Doji Hajime
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Re: Crane Paths and Kotei Choices

Postby Doji Hajime » Mon Apr 27, 2015 4:50 pm

I going to say something very possibly controversial but The Crane are not the most honourable clan, it often appears that we are but we are not. when ever possible we try but if it honestly going to hurt us to be honourable with cut a deal of some sort and move on. we do try to always look good but push come to shove, we will cheat the system. Hell can you think of a better reason that than for Doji to create the system but to always give us a leg up when we need it. The Clan always survives and get back on top. Honestly doesn't always translate into the CCG but it is what the clan is. harriers were a part of that.
Doji Hajime
Crane Iaijutsu Sensei • Duelist • Samurai • Loyal • Exp 3

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Kakita Onimaru
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Re: Crane Paths and Kotei Choices

Postby Kakita Onimaru » Mon Apr 27, 2015 5:19 pm

There is nothing dishonorable, or less than honorable, about making deals. And in a weird technicality, even lying isn't all that dishonorable. Honesty is definitely a virtue, but it is measured against sincerity. So if someone speaks a lie sincerely enough, that can't be accused of lying. At best they are guilty of believing something untrue to be true.

But overall, the Crane don't really cheat the system. We don't have to. We designed the system to make sure it plays to our favor. absolutely nothing dishonorable about it.

We exist in contrast to the scorpion clan. Its not so much there lying that's dishonorable (but it does make people mad), its that they use the information they have to blackmail people. Also, the ninjas.
If you're having Crane problems I feel bad for you son,
I've got 99 problems but a duel ain't one!

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Doji Satevis
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Re: Crane Paths and Kotei Choices

Postby Doji Satevis » Mon Apr 27, 2015 5:35 pm


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Kakita Onimaru
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Re: Crane Paths and Kotei Choices

Postby Kakita Onimaru » Mon Apr 27, 2015 6:11 pm

As for allies, we're not overly vocal about it, but we do grumble everytime we are in a conflict on (link NSFW). And the fact that no one tried to help us against the Mantis is annoying. But the real kicker was WC3, where the Cranes (I wasn't in that delegation. I was Tomoe then) made a bunch of allies and even solidified plans to divert the rivers the Mantis were using to choke out their military advantage. None of that was portrayed in the story.


What I think would be a wonderful solution would be to simply make winning a clan V clan conflict dependent on kotei wins. Much like how we are battleing on Icons right now, make a winning option at a Kotei for a clan to help/hurt a particular side. Lay out bonuses other clans would get if they helped a particular side as to avoid favoritism (help the Lion and gain military support. Help the Scorpion and get political support) and let the kotei wins dictate how a particular war goes. It gets the players involved to determine the fates of their clans.
If you're having Crane problems I feel bad for you son,
I've got 99 problems but a duel ain't one!

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Re: Crane Paths and Kotei Choices

Postby Kakita Kuzuri » Mon Apr 27, 2015 6:58 pm

I must say, it is really good to see all of this activity on the Crane Forum again, particularly the expression of what the Clan means to each and what we want more of, regardless of what I personally agree/disagree with.
People discussing what they love about the Crane = AWESOME.

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Re: Crane Paths and Kotei Choices

Postby Martino » Mon Apr 27, 2015 7:43 pm

I think one of the subtle problems with Crane's overall narrative (and the reason I am actively trying to rekindle our war with the Lion) is that we often express our political savvy as achieving peace and alliance and friendship with our neighbors. This is a nice goal, but it doesn't lend itself to interesting stories. I would much prefer if our savvy expressed itself as us having the same kind of enemies that everyone else has, but that our political prowess prevents them from being allowed to do anything about it.

The war with the Lion and the perpetual Crane Imperial Consort from the pre-history of the game tied into each other nicely. The Lion hated us, and their armies massively outmatched ours. And yet, they could never force total war because the Emperor would always end up telling them to leave his in-laws alone. And the Lion couldn't do anything about it! It was lovely!

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Re: Crane Paths and Kotei Choices

Postby Daramere » Mon Apr 27, 2015 8:18 pm

My guess is that you would be less satisfied than you might think at the Lion scenario you're portraying. There is a conflict between the desire to have the Crane be seen as not being pushovers on the battlefield, and replaying that classic storyline, because an integral part of that classic storyline is that yeah, the Crane can use their political skills to stop the Lion from waging total war on them - because if they Crane didn't, then the Lion would just crush them. While it's a display of political power, there's also a certain element of hiding behind mommy's skirts.

At the end of the day, I imagine that a more proactive display of political oomph would be more satisfying. Something that leaves Hiromi shaking his head and wondering how there ended up being a Crane commander in charge of that newly-minted Imperial Navy, and high-tech ships being built in Crane ports with materials he's agreed to supply. Or whatever.

Or, and I'm just spit-balling here, your courtiers could realize that they got used by the Khan, and as part of their plan to take down the Otomo they fix that mess that they got the Otomo to cause between Naleesh and Shikei. Then I'll even officially rescind my desire to punch your guys in the face. ;)

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Re: Crane Paths and Kotei Choices

Postby Martino » Mon Apr 27, 2015 8:45 pm

Do you really think that AEG could create a position like Commander of the Imperial Navy and then not make it a tournament prize? I'm pretty sure a bunch of people have already said that having positions shouldn't be our thing.

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Daidoji Tacticus
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Re: Crane Paths and Kotei Choices

Postby Daidoji Tacticus » Mon Apr 27, 2015 9:04 pm

I feel I should point out that "the Crane" had nothing to do with the Naleesh-Shikei mess - the outcome of which, frankly, was preordained the second Shikei got an Otomo mediator involved. The Otomo were never in a million years going to recommend anything that led to a marriage between two Clan Champions, or even a marriage of a Champion and an ex-Champion. That sort of ironclad link between two Clans is the stuff of nightmares for them; the Pincer Gozoku has to be giving them enough sleepless nights as it is. And I have to wonder if that was Shikei's intention all along - did he really think the Otomo were going to hand down a ruling that both sides would find agreeable?

Anyway, the total involvement of any Crane in this, at all, was Dainagon talking to an Otomo and offering some very common-sense advice - if the concern is that Shikei and Naleesh are in love, they should do the proper Rokugani thing and have a discreet affair. If they must marry, then Shikei is just a dude and Naleesh is a reborn Kami; the Unicorn position is more reasonable. I cannot fault any of this, and in any case, Dainagon was speaking solely for herself, not conveying suggestions from anyone of authority in the Crane. Attributing the ultimate results of her suggestions to "the Crane" makes about as much sense as, I don't know, attributing the ultimate results of Kituski Kinaro's investigations to "the Dragon".
Ceterum autem censeo Otomines esse delendam.

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Re: Crane Paths and Kotei Choices

Postby Daramere » Mon Apr 27, 2015 9:25 pm



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